Jersey Arts Podcast

Theater Meets Mixed Martial Arts for Hamilton's Okieriete Onaodowan in World Premiere Play

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If you’re a fan of Hamilton, he needs no introduction. Okieriete Onaodowan – also known as Oak to friends and fans – originated the roles of Hercules Mulligan and James Madison in the mega-hit musical. He also played Dean Miller on the TV show Station 19 and leads the new series Demascus–now streaming on Tubi–which the LA Times called a “must-watch”.

Born and raised in New Jersey, Oak is back in the Garden State at Two River Theater in Red Bank working on a play called The Monsters–a world premiere and co-production with Manhattan Theatre Club.

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Maddie Orton:

Hi, I'm Maddie Orton, and this is the Jersey Arts Podcast. If you're a fan of Hamilton, he needs no introduction. Okieriete Onaodowan, also known as Oak to friends and fans, originated the roles of Hercules Mulligan and James Madison in the mega hit Tony Dominating Culture Shifting Musical. He also played Dean Miller on the TV show Station 19 and leads the new series Damascus, now streaming on Tubi, which the LA Times called a must-watch. Born and raised in New Jersey, Oak is back in the Garden State at Two River Theater in Red Bank, working on a play called The Monsters, a world premiere and co-production with Manhattan Theater Club. We talked about his new play, the intersection of theater and sports, how he got his start here in New Jersey, his TV show Damascus, and of course, Hamilton. Take a listen. Thank you so much for joining me. It is lovely to see you always.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yes.

Maddie Orton:

So you're in Redbank right now. Like it's not right right now, but you've been in Redbank. You're working with Two River Theater in co-production with Manhattan Theater Club on the world premiere of a play called The Monsters. What's the show about?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

It's a sibling love story. That's the tagline, but it's really for siblings, or even if you have cousins that feel like siblings. Two estranged siblings kind of find each other years later. The older brother, Big, he's an MMA fighter. The younger sister has gone through some things that you'll find out in the show. And uh she shows up on his doorstep, and the the play just kind of explores them reconnecting, finding each other. You find out why they kind of lost contact over the years. But it's really about um just the love you have for your family and how it just never goes away. And no matter how much time is spent apart, it's it's ever present and it just takes reconnecting to find it again.

Maddie Orton:

That's really nice.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

And like familial love is is the most healing love of all, I think. Overall, I think is the message. So it's really relatable to everyone and anyone.

Maddie Orton:

And do you have siblings?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I do, do. I have many, I many siblings, uh five sisters. So I I get it.

Maddie Orton:

Five sisters, and you are the only brother. That's fantastic. What was that like?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I know nothing else. Uh yeah. I I've I've learned to listen, it teaches you how to listen intently. Sure. I think when you have brothers, you can fight out certain things, but when you're only the only boy, you can't necessarily like fight your feelings away, so you have to find a way. You have you need the gift of gap, let's say. Uh so I'm grateful for that. They've they've taught me that.

Maddie Orton:

That's great. And you play a mixed martial arts fighter. You've done MMA before, right?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I've trained. Uh, you yeah, I've trained and I've always uh been into some form of martial arts as a way of uh training. Actually, during Hamilton, I would train in jujitsu a lot, and then uh I got injured. A brown belt kind of jammed my shoulder when I was rolling with him, and that was kind of like the end of it. And whatnot, and a passion of mine. But yeah, I've always been interested in I did Rocky the Musical, and when I was doing that, I got really into boxing and started boxing, and I just kind of kept it going. So this play kind of marries some things that I love with my profession, which I'm grateful for.

Maddie Orton:

Yeah, I was thinking about that. Like you are in a very weird intersection of like having done Rocky, doing the monsters, you are like, I guess, one of the go-to actors who can do both theater and actual fighting. Like you actually can box and actually can do mixed martial arts and jujitsu, right? Like that's pretty awesome.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah, it's a it's a lovely thing to have that I'm glad I never have to utilize.

Maddie Orton:

But it's a good niche though. I like that.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah, it teaches you discipline too. I think in my sports background, too. There's a level of discipline, I think, from athletes or athletics or anyone who trains that goes into the arts. I think that kind of serves you in a way. There's a level of discipline you need in what we do that just stay on task and stay the course and hit it again and hit it again. Same thing with rehearsal, run it again, run it again. No, the not getting bored and tired of the repetition, I think, is very important in theater.

Maddie Orton:

Yeah, I would think it's also another place where when people say one more time, it never means one more time. Is that yeah.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah, definitely.

Maddie Orton:

What sports did you play growing up?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I played football in in high school. Yeah.

Maddie Orton:

How was that?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

It was great. I fractured my femur early on, and that's kind of what led me into this career. I had a compound fracture in my my my my left leg. And because of that, A, it saved me from many concussions later. But the only other passion I really had was performing the arts. So I was that typical jock of the arts kind of thing, and then the fates kind of made the decision.

Maddie Orton:

I don't know if that's a typical the typical jock of the arts.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I could be wrong, but I felt like No, I think you're right.

Maddie Orton:

But I think it's one of those things where it's like it's so cool because it like if it happens, it's like one guy in your high school.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah.

Maddie Orton:

Right? Like it's not like there are so many. It's pretty cool.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah. I think so. I don't know. I hope so.

Maddie Orton:

I was also thinking, too, it's kind of like with the MMA, with the boxing, having never done either, because I I am way too afraid, I would imagine it's a sort of thing where you also have to be similar to working with the scene partner, present and like reading that person's behavior. Is that true?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Especially in jujitsu. Like, say it's like chess, because when you get to a point where you're almost not even looking at your opponent, you're literally just breathing and feeling. Like I can feel what he's doing with his legs, I can feel his arm shifting, I can feel him shifting weight in his hips. So that informs me more than necessarily what I see. You just get familiar with kind of patterns of physical patterns. Like if someone's going for an arm bar, they may shift in that way. If someone's going for, I don't know, a kamura, they may shift a certain way. If they're trying to sweep you, the better you get at understanding that language. And I think it also works in in theater, especially in musical theater. When you're doing a show over and over again, you start to sense certain things. So uh I think in in especially musical theater, everyone has that moment where something's off and everyone just stops. They can't necessarily say what it is, but we're so used to the show going a certain way, and there's a quick course correction. You have to quickly assess is it their leg, especially with dancers? Are they injured? What's going on? It's their arm. Everyone very quickly is like, all right, how do we get him off? How do we shift it to his right side if it if it's their left arm? But there's a a lot of you have to really understand how the body moves, and with your scene partner, it's the same same. It's just me and Anye, uh Mizelle, she's the other actress. We're doing a lot of physicality. So if she's injured, there's I I've gotta be able to sense it in course correct in in kind of real time, um, which will not happen. We will be healthy and no injuries.

Maddie Orton:

That's great. Yes, I'm knocking wood right now. Speaking about musical theater, can we talk about Hamilton for a second?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Oh, yeah.

Maddie Orton:

Okay. So, first of all, congratulations on 10 years of Hamilton. That is incredible.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

It is. It's a it's been incredible to see how affected people still are by the show. At least for me, that was the most shocking and inspiring thing to see that all these years later, people are still very much so excited about going to see the thing that we did. It's not like a revamping. You know what I'm saying? It's like, no, it's literally what we did 10 years ago, but it resonates still with uh with so many fans. That's incredibly humbling.

Maddie Orton:

Yeah, it's funny you should say that because I I watched the Tony's performance from June where the cast reunited into that incredible mashup performance, and I felt like crying, which feels like a really weird thing to say because I was not in the original cast of Hamilton. It is, and I it was funny because I I was thinking, why do I feel so emotionally connected to this show? And I did see the show and I loved the show, but I realized that I listened to the cast recording, on which you are excellent, by the way. I appreciate it, over and over and over. And I feel like I've taken that journey with these characters and to see the original cast come together just felt so beautiful. And I was wondering if there are so many people like me who do feel so emotionally connected to the show. What was that experience like for you to realize that you are on this just very weird roller coaster of being on a massive cultural phenomenon, which I mean, for Broadway happens what, like every 20 years, maybe?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah. Um, it's an it's incredible because of the love we have for each other. Like what made it a great experience was because we loved each other so much for all of us to be back in the room again. That's very rare when you do something like this. Normally someone falls off or someone is recast, or if they try to get the cast back together, someone's missing, or God forbid, you know, someone is passed on. You see that with reunions and whatnot. But it was just incredible to have everyone in the room again, like it was then. That rehearsal room, that's what made it special, and because we we really genuinely love each other, you know, it's not like all right, man, we gotta get back in the room and do this thing, and like hopefully we get paid. You know what I mean? Like that changes the experience. It was just kind of like, How are you doing? Some people have kids, like everyone is grown. So it's like, yeah, we're all back in it doing the thing again. That is what is is is so special and amazing, and it's one of those things that you can't really um I think it's just the genuine love that you can't market that, you can't falsely create that, you can't, you know, and I think that's what people are reacting to, not to get too like woo-woo, but just general true energy, like the energy of putting a certain group of people together again and not swapping out a piece. I think that is just something that I can't I can't even explain and didn't realize until we're on the room. We're like, oh yeah, this is this is something special. It's the same voices you've heard then, the same tones, the same everything. And it's it's rare. It's very rare and special.

Maddie Orton:

I think you can feel that for sure. I think it's like a like a larger manifestation of an overtone when you're in choir almost where all these voices come and you feel that extra layer of yeah, energy, something like that.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah, it's like a band. It's like you can get replacement singers, but like everyone's voice is its own unique barcode, it's its own unique signature. So that blend is literally based on the voices you get. You see cover bands, they change the lead singer, they sound like them, but it's a different, everyone's voice is different. So if you get all those pieces back together, then you're like, oh, that's the sound I know from the record. Yeah. Because it is the sound from the record. Like it literally is. It's all of the same voices.

Maddie Orton:

Was there a moment where you realized, oh, this is different? Not so much the show itself, but just the cultural impact of this show. I mean, like, did you go from being working New York actor to being somebody where on the street you're spotted by a stranger and they go, Oh my god, Hercules Mulligan? Does that must be so weird? When did that happen for you?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I mean, it it really happened after more so after Disney Plus. Okay. After it came out on Disney Plus, at least for me, I noticed that way more because COVID was one. A lot of people would be at home watching it over and over again because of the kids, so they're watching it. So I've been on set for different things. I shot this show called Damascus, and I was working with Martin Lawrence. Uh huh. Martin Lawrence was like, hey man, I need to get a picture with you from my daughter because you know she loves it. She loves, you know, she loves Hamilton, loves Hercules Mulligan. So it's moments like that where I'm like, oh, this is some, this is something else. Because people I admire, their children made them watch it like 20 times. They're just stuck at home with nothing to do. So they're watching it over and over and over and over again, you know, like when we were kids, how we watched Aladdin over and over again, or Little Mermaid, or you know, how you'd watch that VHS, like that is we were that for a whole generation of children. Um, and now their parents are walking around singing under the sea because their kid wanted to watch Little Mermaid like you know, 300 times. So that that that was a moment, and then really at the 10 year, that's when I realized, man, it really got people through some stuff. I got a lot of fan mail from folks saying, like, you know, the show helped them. But again, 10 years later, just to see people like people love Hercules Mulligan, you know, get back up again. Many people said something about that, you know, a credit to Lynn as well. Um, and the energy that I felt from that character, people were like moved by it. And that is the most impressed, that's the most humbling thing to me. Not that it was a hit, not that people love it because it made them want to turn up, but it's like I put that record on on dark times. Like that is as an artist, it's like that's what you want. I love that. You know, you want to help people, at least I think as an artist, you make art because you want to help people process, get over things, overcome things, be inspired by stuff. So that's the biggest blessing for me from this project is that it's inspired people, helped people through things, it keeps people going. Um, and it's a fun time, great. But that aspect is what makes me really proud of it.

Maddie Orton:

You brought up Damascus, which is a very cool premise and has gotten some terrific reviews. Do you do you want to tell people a little bit what the TV show is about?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Well, Damascus is a half-hour television show that I shot. I mentioned Martin Lawrence is in it with me, and and Janet Hubbard is in it as well, the original Aunt Viv. And it's basically about a young man who is trying to process his place in life by going through experimental altered reality therapy, where he kind of experiences himself in alternate reality, alternate versions of himself to try to sort out kind of what his purpose is, um, which I think is really relatable to a lot of people. I think it's uh really necessary for a lot of young men, just to young black men, but young men in general, to say, like, go see a therapist if you're not processing stuff, talk to somebody. It's okay to say, I have no idea, and I'm trying to figure it out. That's great. And uh the response I've been getting from a lot of people is they feel that is what resonates with them. They're like, Man, just seeing someone who just is just trying to sort it out and really uncovering things and exploring things and uh being vulnerable, I think, is is really important now more than ever. I think there's a high rise in uh an archaic toxic masculinity. I think it's important to kind of promote the idea of no, you do not have it all figured out. It's okay to ask for help.

Maddie Orton:

I love the idea of being able to experience different timelines to sort of work through work through somebody's life and figure out, you know, what what would have been the best thing for me? What is the right path? Do you think you would do that if you had the opportunity?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Is that a healthy thing or do you think we I definitely would. I read all the comments, so I'm a glutton for data. I read comments and everything. I'm just kind of like, really? Not too weird. What did you say? And then I look up their page and I was like, oh, like I like I would totally explore it all. I think uh knowledge is power. The trick is, you know, working on yourself enough that you can actively and in a healthy way hang on to all of that knowledge. You know, a battery will short circuit if it's not built to hold all the energy coming in, so it's just like fortify your battery and then take in all the energy that you can, and then you can use it for whatever you want. Um, but uh I I think I would. I think it would be a slippery slope. But I think in a version, artists and specifically actors were kind of built for that.

Maddie Orton:

That is true.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I allow myself to daydream and say, like, well, uh yeah, what if I was in a world where there's an alternate reality and I was out of shape and I really wanted the da-da-da-da-da. Or what if I was an MMA fighter and I had an estranged sister who came and found me? You know, like we we do that already. And we hold that space to be like, oh, this is my what I would feel like in that situation, because you have to believe it for the audience to believe it. So I think I totally would embark on alternate realities and versions of myself to see and understand like myself fully.

Maddie Orton:

Are you saying that you read the comments like people are saying this is what I would do or I wouldn't do this, or this is a good idea?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Oh, I'm just saying I'm a mascist. I read the comments for everything. I know some people are like, I'm never reading comments for stuff online. Yeah, like if I'm on Instagram or something, the first thing I was like, what are what is all the madness? What are people saying?

Maddie Orton:

And so people talk about Damascus and they say, like, this is a good idea or not a good idea. Yeah, yeah.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

For Damascus, the comments are great. It's just love. People are happy about it, they really want a season two. They're they're wondering, well, you know, is it coming? What's happening with the show? And the comments are are just saying like they really appreciate seeing this character go on this journey.

Maddie Orton:

Yeah, it's cool.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

And I think a lot of people right now would love to dip into an alternate reality to see what the world is like if it were different, to see what how they would react to things uh uh differently, and uh are just seeking guidance on like what am I supposed to do? Yeah, how am I supposed to be? Let's find out.

Maddie Orton:

That's cool. And you mentioned that you're working with some very cool people in this project, but what if it was just Martin Lawrence? Like, did you grow up watching Martin Lawrence?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah, I grew up watching Martin, and I love Bad Boys, and all of his stand-ups are classic and a deaf comedy jam. I would watch, and he was a host for the longest time. And uh he was just great and gracious. He dove right in, uh, no ego at all. He's like, let's figure it out. He would let me play, you know, a couple times. He'd be like, Hey man, you're funny. You're funny, you you're funny, kid.

Maddie Orton:

And I'm like, I feel like I could die happy if somebody like Martin Lawrence was like, You're funny.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I think it's great. I just I just want the show to take off so we can have interviews and that can be spread out to the world. Yeah, but he was great, and and Janet was awesome, again, gracious, she's a legend, and they both were just kind of like, let's play, let's let's find the scene, let's figure it out, and very collaborative, which you don't always find sometimes with with you know living legends, you know, sometimes there's ego, but neither of them had that. They really just wanted to make the best version of the show that they could.

Maddie Orton:

I would think between Hamilton and Damascus and all the work you've done at this point, that you have met a lot of Living Legends. Do you ever get starstruck or are you cool with it?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I'm pretty cool with it because I'm meeting them in the context of like what I do. Like I love this. So the only time was like maybe after like Hamilton, if someone's hanging out, you know, Dave Chappelle, love Dave Chappelle. Oh my gosh. But even then, it's still like, oh, I just like this is home for me. Like I'm on stage, this is where I'm like I belong, this is where I feel most comfortable. So um, not not not not so much. I'm I'm I've tried to just recognize every person I admire as just a person, you know, and it starts with your parents, they're just people.

Maddie Orton:

That's a hard lesson, too.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

It's a tough one, you know, and that you still digest. But early on, I was just kind of like, you know, are my parents are people and they did the best they could, and no one bats a thousand. And I really try to carry that with any other human being. There's nothing a human being in this world, there's nothing they can do that you can't do. But like Damascus, you just there's a reality where you had the same circumstances that allowed you to do that.

Maddie Orton:

You were a young artist in New Jersey. Tell me about how you got involved in theater growing up and where you're from.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Uh yeah, I'm from New Jersey. Originally from uh I graduated from West Orange High School, but born and raised in Newark. Uh, shout out to East Orange uh for toughening me up. Yeah, uh, I know you from Rutgers University. Are you rah-rah? That's right. Ra-rah, where I was kicked out of Rutgers. Did not graduate from New York.

Maddie Orton:

And no one ever heard from you again.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

No one ever heard from me again, you know. Uh it's college or bust kids. Uh, but yeah, that's that's the background. It's very meteoric rise. You know, I worked in the fringe festivals, did every random downtown show you could think of, and did the first national of American idiot detour. That's the first Broadway debut, didn't have a line, understudied everybody, Serena de Bergerac with Jamie Lloyd. That's how I know Jamie Lloyd. We've known each other for a very long time. So it was very boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop to rock and the musical, to Hamilton, to like all of it has just been just working hard and and and always chasing what moves me as an artist.

Maddie Orton:

How did you find theater originally? Like, what was your first moment where you were like, I think I want to do this, or the first show that you got to do?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Oh, the first play I ever did was Bye bye Birdie in Middle School.

Maddie Orton:

Oh, stop it. I did bye bye birdie in middle school.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I was one of the bodyguards.

Maddie Orton:

You were what? And one of the bodyguards of the sorry, you you did not have lines in your stop it.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

No, I never really did. No.

Maddie Orton:

That's wild.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah, in high school, it's uh I was kind of like the jag of all trades. So in high school, the theater director Sandy Van Dyke, she would be like, I would just plug in. I work crew, I would work backstage, do stage crew, and then on stage she'd be like, I need someone here, or I need someone to do this. And I would just kind of like plug in. So that kind of started my whole character actor. I think some would consider me me trying to be many different characters. Most of the roles I play are very different from each other, which I like, and I try to keep that going. They're all just wild, wildly different. Um, but that's where it started.

Maddie Orton:

How did you go from stage crew to being put in there to saying, actually, I like being on stage? What was the show that did that for you?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I was really in football when I got injured.

Maddie Orton:

So well you were like, This is my fallback. I think I'll just go to Broadway.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

I wanted to play ball. I was an inside linebacker, and in in my brain, like that's what I was gonna do. Right. The coaches were kind of like, I never played pop horn or anything, so I really started in high school, and the coach was like, Yeah, you know, we we want to teach you everything and learn everything, and you'll be really great. And then when I uh I got injured, that kind of shifted. It shifted all of it. And I was like, I couldn't walk for six months. I just had to physically I was not able to be as athletic as I wanted to, so it was like, Well, what am I gonna do now? And the only other passion I really had was well, not only passion, but the only place that would take me really was was theater. Like academia I wasn't really strong in, and and that's the only place that I felt home. And there's a level of performance in sports that you get also in theater, you know. There's a camaraderie in sports that you also have in theater. Like when that ball is snapped on the field, it's just this the dudes, the 12 dudes that are with you. It's like we gotta figure this out. And in theater, same thing. Lights up, it's like it's just us on this stage. If something goes wrong, we gotta have each other's back. Still hundreds of people watching you. So there are a lot of similarities there that I'm realizing now. Unbeknownst to me.

Maddie Orton:

You mentioned your theater teacher. Was she a big part of your sort of artistic awakening?

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Oh, huge, huge. Yeah, Sandra Van Dyke, she was huge. She really brought a professional element to our high school that was not there before. Taking us to competitions, making sure we understood um the discipline needed, you know, in terms of like, you know, rehearsal, rehearsal, rehearsal, always have your lines down. Like you just have to work on work on it. She got a lot of flack, but she didn't believe in seniority. She was just kind of like, whoever's great gets it. If you're a freshman, you're great, you get the role. If you're senior, you're not great, you're not getting it. Because you she really wanted to build the best show and really taught discipline, like serious discipline. And because of her, uh, I I really that is what allowed me to have the work ethic I needed, I think, to be successful in this industry.

Maddie Orton:

Yeah, I know that you are now paying it forward and you're helping with kids who love theater. Tell me a little bit about that.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

So American Young Voices, someone reached out to me. It's uh an amazing uh organization. What they do is they go to schools all over the world and all over New Jersey, but they're focusing specifically in Newark. And since I was born in Newark, someone reached out to me and I and I went, I saw a show that they did, and I was so inspired. And they get, I think it's middle school, elementary school, and middle school kids, maybe like two or three thousand. They go to many different high schools, they give them music to learn, and then they have a concert. So the kids have an experience of performing at the prudential center, you know, being backstage, getting what it what that experience is like, and all the parents for free are invited. They bust all the kids in, they provide all the kids with meals and so on and so forth. The parents can can they all sit down and watch their kids like on stage perform, and they normally have like guest singers come in, and it's it's it's it's really incredible. And uh after I saw the show, I said, Man, I would I would love to be involved. So I'm working with them on like a fundraiser to help raise money to help support the kids, support the buses and the food and and all the things they need to facilitate on December 8th.

Maddie Orton:

And people can look up American Young Voices if they want to learn more about that. Yeah, very cool. Uh Oak, you're the best. Thanks so much for making the time. I appreciate it. And and great luck with the monsters. Sounds like an amazing show.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Yeah, Monsters at Two River Theater with a co pro with MCT. So come check us out, bring your siblings and have a good cry.

Maddie Orton:

Thanks for being here.

Okieriete Onaodowan:

Thanks for having me.

Maddie Orton:

Thanks to Oak for joining me. The Monsters runs from November 5th through the 23rd at Two River Theater. For more information, visit TwoRiverTheater.org. That's theater with an ER. If you liked this episode, be sure to give us a review, subscribe, and tell your friends. A transcript of this podcast, as well as links to related content and more about the arts in New Jersey, can be found on jerseyarts.com. The Jersey Arts Podcast is presented by Art Pride New Jersey, advancing a state of creativity since 1986. The show is co-founded by and currently supported by funds from the New Jersey State Council on the Arts. This episode was hosted, produced, and edited by yours truly, Maddie Orton. Executive producers are Jim Atkinson and Isaac Serna Diez. Special thanks to Oak and Two River Theater. I'm Maddie Orton for the Jersey Arts Podcast. Thanks for listening.

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